Three years ago, when the Otago Daily Times last went to Wellington for a chat with the Labour Party leader, a different person was the incumbent prime minister and they were very different times.
Jacinda Ardern had just led what was considered a highly successful response to the Covid-19 pandemic and despite her natural caution, voters were about to reward her with an unprecedented overall majority in the 2020 election.
Fast forward two and a-half years and Ms Ardern, her gas tank approaching empty, has gone, as has the cheery, colourful clutter with which her office was crammed. At her old desk sits Chris Hipkins, who if the decor is anything to go by, is taking a more slimmed down and pragmatic approach to governing New Zealand.
"I’ve only been in the job for seven months or so, so I guess I am still putting my own stamp on things," Mr Hipkins said.
"A lot of the work that has been under way while I have been prime minister was work which started under Jacinda and I am seeing many projects through to completion. I think that the campaign period is an opportunity for me to set out a bit more what I would like to do in the next term, so that will have a slightly different flavour to what Jacinda set out during the last election.
"But I also believe that even if you change the personnel at the top that you still have to keep faith with the electorate in terms of what they voted for last time ... the election is a chance for us to reset some of that and offer a different platform and different ideas for the next three years."
The government has had an enormous influence on people’s lives in recent years as Mr Hipkins, who served a stint as minister responsible for Covid-19, well knows.
Although the pandemic remains a threat — and Mr Hipkins hopes greater consideration for other people will be a legacy of it — such widescale intervention should be a thing of the past.
Where now should the balance sit regarding how much say over our lives the state has?
"I think that in the Covid era people accepted that the state’s role was going to be a very active one for a period of time, but I don’t think that necessarily changes their views for perpetuity," Mr Hipkins said.
"But I do think that Kiwis do want to see that the state is focused on creating a better New Zealand and that does mean a stronger economy that benefits more people.
"I think people do believe that there is a role for the state in ending inequality — I do.
"When you cut taxes you cut funding for so many of the things that New Zealanders rely upon, even on the right. Look at law and order — if you cut taxes you cut funding for those things."
The economy is central to all election campaigns but as inflation remains high and the cost of living continues to dominate people’s lives, more than ever electoral success for all parties depends on convincing voters that they are best equipped to manage the country’s money.
Mr Hipkins does not shy away from the fact that it is tough going out there at the moment and that so many households are struggling with the cost of living.
"I put that front and centre because right now balancing the weekly grocery bill and paying for the power and filling the car up, paying the rent, these are things that people are struggling with.
"But I do believe that the fundamentals of the New Zealand economy are actually very positive.
"We still have very low debt compared to the rest of the world, we still have very low unemployment and that’s a really positive sign as we move through this difficult period — actually being in work is the best way to support people to sustain themselves through tough times."
Unsurprisingly for a Labour leader, Mr Hipkins places great store in keeping unemployment low and expanding employment opportunities.
"Fundamentally, I believe that people want to create a better life for themselves and the people that they care about, and that people are willing to work hard for that," he said.
"What they want to know is that the government is creating the right environment for that to happen: that there will be good jobs available to them and that those jobs will be well paid, that there will be public services to equip them through education with the skills and knowledge to be able to take up those job opportunities.
"That there will be a health system that cares for their wellbeing, that there will be a well-funded and robust law and order system so that they will be safe within their communities, within their workplaces and their homes, and I believe that the state should provide a safety net for those who find themselves fallen upon tough times."
This shapes as a very difficult election campaign for Labour. The insulation that its historic 2020 majority should give it is being pulled apart, and polling suggests the centre right has a genuine chance of regaining the Treasury benches.
Mr Hipkins, however, cautions against assuming that how the political landscape seems at the start of the election cycle means things will inevitably end up that way.
"We have only just started the campaign," he said.
"The National Party seems to think that they can start measuring up for new curtains but in reality I think the voters get to determine that and we haven’t really started campaigning yet. I am feeling very optimistic.
"The thing about a democracy is that the voters are always right."
Hipkins on:
The green economy: "I think that there are massive opportunities ahead of us. If we think about our agriculture and primary industries, we could be one of the cleanest, greenest, most sustainable primary producers in the world "
Climate change: "I think if we focus on the things that are actually going to give us the best bang for buck, I think that we can accelerate progress on climate change issues."
Tax: "I don’t see tax as the answer to every conceivable problem that the government might face ... my argument would be that a tax cut isn’t going to mean much to you if you’ve lost your job: I don’t think that we can cut our way to prosperity."
MMP: "I think all political leaders have to be willing to compromise and they have to be willing to work with others."
Local issues
The new Dunedin hospital: "I think people are getting a bit worked up about nothing much, the design of the new Dunedin hospital allows plenty of opportunity for future growth. We can, in the future, add more funding to add more capability to the hospital."
Housing in Queenstown: "It is a bit unique and I wouldn’t rule out doing something specific for Queenstown, but having said that we are making slow progress there, opening up more space."
Oamaru Hospital: "There is an international shortage of health workers. The work in Oamaru, in partnership with Te Whatu Ora, should ensure that contingency plans are in place and that should make a difference for that community."
Tiwai Point: "It is a fluid situation and I think we need to work our way through that. I think there is a future for Tiwai Point, one way or the other. It will still be a source of significant industry and significant jobs, whether it be doing aluminium or doing something else."
• Monday, Act New Zealand leader David Seymour.
